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8.8 Update


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#141 Max H

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Posted 22 September 2013 - 0610 AM

tiger now has a higher rate of fire than the panther 2 with the long 88


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#142 eurico_viegas

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Posted 22 September 2013 - 0619 AM

tiger now has a higher rate of fire than the panther 2 with the long 88

lets face it, this Tiger buff constitutes a clear example of russian bias  :D


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#143 Stefan Fredriksson

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Posted 22 September 2013 - 0928 AM

Strangely enough Tiger P with same gun has old, or at least considerably worse, rof.

Tiger is now way more agreeable to play.

My guess is that rof will be lowered within two patches.
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#144 eurico_viegas

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Posted 22 September 2013 - 1036 AM

Strangely enough Tiger P with same gun has old, or at least considerably worse, rof.

Tiger is now way more agreeable to play.

My guess is that rof will be lowered within two patches.

yep, the Porsche kept the old gun stats. your guess makes some sense, the +2 rpm buff to ROF was IMHO a bit too much.

the problem is if the tiger gets lowered to, lets say, 8,00 rpm in 0.9.1, the ensuing shitstorm (consisting mainly of "WG nerfed Tiger!! RUSSIAN BIAS!!!1!!!one!" forum posts) would be the largest ever. 


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#145 Max H

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Posted 22 September 2013 - 1414 PM

 

Strangely enough Tiger P with same gun has old, or at least considerably worse, rof.

Tiger is now way more agreeable to play.

My guess is that rof will be lowered within two patches.

yep, the Porsche kept the old gun stats. your guess makes some sense, the +2 rpm buff to ROF was IMHO a bit too much.

the problem is if the tiger gets lowered to, lets say, 8,00 rpm in 0.9.1, the ensuing shitstorm (consisting mainly of "WG nerfed Tiger!! RUSSIAN BIAS!!!1!!!one!" forum posts) would be the largest ever. 

 

 

 

I look forward to it ^_^

 

Tiger P has the same RoF because they're only tinkering with one line at a time (or at least that's what is claimed, which doesn't explain the view range nerf to the vk4502's)


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#146 Marek Tucan

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 0319 AM

Could you have gone after any more straw men in that reply?  :blink:

Straw men? Just pointing out inevitable results of such tier drop, which would result in at best same amount of fun (but likely much less, as you would end up with less mobility and firepower to get maybe chance to own few more lower tiers once in a while).

The main reason I've argued for something similar for a while is by lowering tanks a tier (and dropping hps, gun selection, and some mobility is almost always a given... neither the article or my replies have stated otherwise) you effectively buff the armor. 

The one tank that would obviously benefit the most would be the Tiger. It's been bad since launch and it's not 'German fanboy-ism' to want a tank that's drawing a lot of players into the game to not suck*. That's just called good game design. The article nor my own posts on this make the claim or are aiming for it to become an 'all killing machine.' Again, the aim is for it to finally play like a heavy and be an average tank rather than a bad one.

The only thing Tiger would have over 36.01 would be 20mm more of side armor. Front armor is generally the same. So you get generally a zero change WRT 36.01. Throwing in few Tier IV tanks as Tiger fodder would not mean that much for it - as you would at the same time have to face still higher tier tanks with significantly worse gun. How is that an improvement?

And it would still be unpopular because guess what? The "wet dream" was not aimed at you but at the mass of players who think they can do propaganda version of Wittmann in the Tiger. Unless you make it ridiculously overpowered, rushing into middle of close combat would still lead to losing. So from the "legendary" point of view dropping Tiger to Tier VI would only diminish its value even more as it would have to lose even gun with best penetration for its tier heavies ;)
 

The discussion about the KT being broken at tier 7 is... odd.  It's an average tier 8 right now.  You don't see it in competitive play nor do you see it in tournament play as there are other heavies, both auto-loader and regular, that are simply better.


Competitive play has significantly more restricted choice simply because it does not deal too well with all-rounders, instead going for maximal performance in selected field (esp. burst DPM or Alpha or protection).
I did not claim it will be broken, I claimed it will have to face significant nerfs to balance its armor. No way how that is going to be accepted well. It would have been broken if you simply dropped it a tier, so in order to not be broken it would have to be nerfed hard.
 

The article linked didn't even mention leaving the E-75s armor the same, but for the sake of argument for both the 75 and KT if you did do that I don't see a problem (again, when you factor in the other normal things that come along with a tier drop: less hps, mobility, and gun selection).  There are already tanks in the game that are effectively immune to same tier fire from the front.  None of them break the game as they have vulnerabilities.  The KT and 75 would still retain the massive German size coupled with easily penned sides and rear which make them vulnerable in the current game.
 
*I'm aware of the rather significant dpm boost it got this last patch.  We'll have to wait and see, though, if that makes it worthwhile to play.


And I was pointing to the inevitable backlash all these balancing changes would bring. And in the effect they won't make the tanks more enjoyable to play, rather opposite - think of it as combining pre-8.8 top speed and turning with 8.8 acceleration - not much fun, mobility-wise, right? Same with RoF and other nerfs. Dropping a tier really would not help to make them more fun (at least if your definition of "fun" contains also "moving there and damaging your enemies").
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#147 Marek Tucan

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 0320 AM

I look forward to it ^_^
 
Tiger P has the same RoF because they're only tinkering with one line at a time (or at least that's what is claimed, which doesn't explain the view range nerf to the vk4502's)


TBH I kind of like the situation as it is now, Tiger H has awesome DPM, Tiger P balances less DPM with better frontal protection.
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