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M1 Ecp Upgrades And M1A3 Program.


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#1 Damian

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Posted 23 March 2015 - 1621 PM

http://www.g8.army.m...Program2015.pdf

Ok I had a hunch and I just checked official US Army modernization strategy and... The ECP modernization program is separate from the real M1A3 program.

M1A3 R&D will start around 2020. My theory that ECP upgrades for M1's are sort of proving ground for new technologies might be true. And M1A3 in the end might be completely new design, tough still considered as part of Abrams tank family of vehicles, it's start to be interesting.


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#2 BLAH

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Posted 23 March 2015 - 2138 PM

I agree.

 

I bet the M1A3 is going to be something quite a bit different in comparison to the M1A1 to M1A2 differences. 

 

I'm guessing they'll keep the hull, so it'll still be an "M1".


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#3 Rickard N

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 0210 AM

I'm thinking short barrel and perhaps a cannon fired missile (or should that be cannonfired?). Big ass commanders cupola and a weird shaped turret.

 

/R


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#4 Damian

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 0432 AM

I agree.

 

I bet the M1A3 is going to be something quite a bit different in comparison to the M1A1 to M1A2 differences. 

 

I'm guessing they'll keep the hull, so it'll still be an "M1".

 

They can just keep some basic components like road wheels, hull belly, while everything else might be completely new. US Army is allready experimenting with unmanned turrets, so I would not be surprised if M1A3 might have one as well, but this of course will also require redesign to the hull.


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#5 zaarin7

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 0804 AM

They first experimented with unmanned turrets on the M1 back in the late 1980's to early 1990's on the TTB, Tank Test Bed.


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#6 Damian

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 0814 AM

Yes we know that. US is very in to unmanned turrets, right now they test unmanned turret for M2 and M1126.

 

Next 5 years will be very interesting, first M1 with ECP upgrades, then M1A3.


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#7 Panzermann

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 1059 AM

I'm thinking short barrel and perhaps a cannon fired missile (or should that be cannonfired?). Big ass commanders cupola and a weird shaped turret.
 
/R


Battlefield:
The final frontier
These are the marchings of the Starship, Abramsprise
Its 50 year mission
To explore strange new combat zones
To seek out new enemies and new opposing forces
To boldly tank where no man has tanked before

(or should that have been the Pruittprise? ;))

 
on a more serious note: The US Army is now going the way of the Patton? That is upgrading the old basic tank design again and again until it is totally surpassed by other newer designs?

Edited by Panzermann, 24 March 2015 - 1101 AM.

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#8 Damian

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 1235 PM

 

on a more serious note: The US Army is now going the way of the Patton? That is upgrading the old basic tank design again and again until it is totally surpassed by other newer designs?

 

No, and do you actually read what others write in this thread? M1A3 might be a completely new design, and might be upgrade of the existing one, we do not know what they plan, but considering that this document is from may 2014, it means they might adjusted their plans before T-14 photos leaks and M1A3 might an answer to it.


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#9 DB

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 1335 PM

Just a few things on the possible list of things for the A3

 

- High voltage electrics (compared to 24V anyway) - saves weight and internal volume

- Hybrid powerplant, maybe serial diesel-electric,but potentially a hydraulic hybrid would suit a tank at least as well. Potential ICE downsize due to "peak shaving" using the hybrid system. Fuel consumption improvement by factor of 2+ (range improvement and/or mass/volume reduction.)

- Novel armour (maybe we'll see the electric armour adopted, particularly for the flanks (survivability).

- Active protection system designed in. (survivability)

- Lighter gun from the recent X-series developments. No need for more than 120mm (mass reduction)

- Autoloader with 3 man crew, as noted possibly unmanned turret (still 3 man crew).(volume improvement, manpower reduction)

- Extended on-watch silent time due to electrical storage. (APU optional?) (Improved operations)

- No hydraulics (improved survivability)

 

None of these really demands a new chassis, but fitting in a full hybrid system with large battery capacity might make it necessary (although halving fuel consumption could mean fuel tank storage space, it may be better to go for a new hull to reduce the vehicle size, with all the usual benefits expected from that in terms of reduced requirement for the protected volume.

 

I believe that most of these things have been tested in various demonstrators over the years, so nothing is outrageously novel. Main issue is probably electric motors suitable for this application, something like 600kW output for each side.

 

Of course, every bit of electronics will be different - 2020 for project start means all the existing electronics will be out of date by some distance (let's face it, by the time they get into a vehicle, they already are)


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#10 Damian

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 1401 PM

Moving crew completely to the hull would mean to redesign it slightly. When I think about M1A3, I think about reviving this:

 

ff83a7d1572a.jpg


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#11 JW Collins

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 1937 PM

Seems like we're back to the whole M1 "Block III" idea which seemed like it was going be an entirely new vehicle.


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#12 DKTanker

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 2134 PM

 

- High voltage electrics (compared to 24V anyway) - saves weight and internal volume

 

If so it will likely have to be AC electrics.  The reason why electrics are stuck at no more than 24vdc is because relays quickly burn out at higher voltages as the contacts open and close.  However, because AC is momentarily dead each time the current changes direction, there is a 50% chance the relay contacts will open or close when the line is dead and thus the burning of contacts is less likely.


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#13 DB

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 2145 PM

You make a good case for there being practical limits on the higher voltage option (But I think that solid state switching is beginning to take over some applications and may not suffer the same problems.)

 

I got the high voltage electrics idea from proposals for regular automotive applications, which turn out to have been superseded by events.

 

http://en.wikipedia....ectrical_system

 

This wikipedia page suggests that alternate means have been adopted to achieve similar ends and the whole idea is effectively dropped - the remaining high voltage elements are the starter/generator in "mild" hybrid applications, and a full hybrid drivetrain makes those irrelevant anyway, so I drop that from my list,

 

Extensive application of modern vehicle electronic architecture is coming - Scout SV (and probably many others) for example uses CANBUS and Ethernet for moving data between subsystems on one or more intra-vehicle networks, but this all falls under the general "replacement electronics" bullet.


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#14 Harkonnen

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Posted 27 March 2015 - 1251 PM

http://www.g8.army.m...Program2015.pdf

Ok I had a hunch and I just checked official US Army modernization strategy and... The ECP modernization program is separate from the real M1A3 program.

M1A3 R&D will start around 2020. My theory that ECP upgrades for M1's are sort of proving ground for new technologies might be true. And M1A3 in the end might be completely new design, tough still considered as part of Abrams tank family of vehicles, it's start to be interesting.

 

 

 

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#15 Damian

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Posted 27 March 2015 - 1300 PM

Because people from former soviet union have blocked access. :P


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#16 sunday

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Posted 27 March 2015 - 1552 PM

Because people from former soviet union have blocked access. :P

 

And people from the US Navy too, it seems :D


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#17 Sovngard

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Posted 27 March 2015 - 1558 PM

 

Because people from former soviet union have blocked access. :P

 

And people from the US Navy too, it seems :D

 

 

But Belgians seem to be able to access without restrictions. B)


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#18 urbanoid

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Posted 27 March 2015 - 1622 PM

 

 

Because people from former soviet union have blocked access. :P

 

And people from the US Navy too, it seems :D

 

 

But Belgians seem to be able to access without restrictions. B)

 

Brussels spying machine!


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#19 DB

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Posted 27 March 2015 - 2128 PM

Works For Me. 

 

Woo-hoo! Not part of the *Other* Evil Empire.


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#20 jmcmtank

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Posted 29 March 2015 - 0722 AM

 

http://www.g8.army.m...Program2015.pdf

Ok I had a hunch and I just checked official US Army modernization strategy and... The ECP modernization program is separate from the real M1A3 program.

M1A3 R&D will start around 2020. My theory that ECP upgrades for M1's are sort of proving ground for new technologies might be true. And M1A3 in the end might be completely new design, tough still considered as part of Abrams tank family of vehicles, it's start to be interesting.

 

 

 

You have attempted to access a blocked website. Access to this website has been blocked for operational reasons by the DOD Enterprise-Level Protection System.

 

APPLICATION: qos-mission-critical-pan

 

Contact your local Network Control Center for information on how to gain access to MISSION ESSENTIAL or otherwise authorized websites, or to report a mis-categorized website.

Navy users click here for additional guidance and procedures for requesting access to blocked content.

 

Here you go; http://jmcmtank.com/...Program2015.pdf


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