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#21 Chris Werb

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Posted 19 September 2017 - 1738 PM

Blast radius looks low for what I guess are 80mm rockets. Practice presumably.

 

In the freeze frame showing the initial explosion it looked about what I would have expected from an 80mm or perhaps larger calibre rocket.


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#22 GARGEAN

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 0120 AM

All that said, its decidedly uncool to have an unsafe weapon whilst pointing the nose at a crowd. And the weapon was clearly unsafe because you have the 'Shoot!' cue come up. When I visited a life fire exercise on Salisbury plain in 2002, they always had the attack aircraft passing parallel to the crowd, never pointing directly at them. Same when they had the tanks firing, it was away from the crowd.

It was by no way pointing at the crowd. It was somewhat like field CP with few parked military cars and couple of men that I'm not sure was supposed to be there in that time in first place.
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#23 Stuart Galbraith

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 0158 AM

 

Blast radius looks low for what I guess are 80mm rockets. Practice presumably.

 

In the freeze frame showing the initial explosion it looked about what I would have expected from an 80mm or perhaps larger calibre rocket.

 

 

But would you expect to walk away THAT close to an 80mm rocket? The Cameraman must have been damn lucky if that was a live warhead. Even the truck looks like it might be repairable. The whole reason why they introduced them in Afghanistan was the wider blast radius from a 57mm rocket. And it wasnt just one rocket, it looks like 2 or 3.

 

 

 

All that said, its decidedly uncool to have an unsafe weapon whilst pointing the nose at a crowd. And the weapon was clearly unsafe because you have the 'Shoot!' cue come up. When I visited a life fire exercise on Salisbury plain in 2002, they always had the attack aircraft passing parallel to the crowd, never pointing directly at them. Same when they had the tanks firing, it was away from the crowd.

It was by no way pointing at the crowd. It was somewhat like field CP with few parked military cars and couple of men that I'm not sure was supposed to be there in that time in first place.

 

 

Im not going to argue the point. Ill suggest any ordinance pointed at soldiers or spectators in a live fire display is completely unnecessary, particularly in a country the size of Russia. Misfires happen, of course they do. So you work a way round so they impact the range rather than spectators.

 

For example, we recently had a life fire accident in Wales, where a Challenger 2 was involved in a HESH explosion (its not clear externally or internally yet). But the point was, cock up though that was, it was other soldiers killed and injured, because the regulations kept people out of the firing line.


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#24 Roman Alymov

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 0340 AM

I cant remember from my time playing Black Shark what the x means. That usually means the weapon is too close to fire, which considering it flashes right after the rockets fire would seem plausible.

Inscription below aiming mark reads “Switch on main (weapons switch)”, indicating firing circuit not activated. But the moment it was switched on – missiles launched.


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#25 Stuart Galbraith

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 0348 AM

Do you get the shoot cue even when its not armed?


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#26 Panzermann

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 0402 AM

Video from different angle:
https://twitter.com/...085036728311808

Judging from this video, it was not "spectators"  but some kind of field command position with KAMAZ-mounted radio station (+another radio vehicle visible) . Niva hit is with military number plates.

 
can well be that they were spectators or rather judges for the exercise and not taking part directly.

 

I cant remember from my time playing Black Shark what the x means. That usually means the weapon is too close to fire, which considering it flashes right after the rockets fire would seem plausible.

Inscription below aiming mark reads “Switch on main (weapons switch)”, indicating firing circuit not activated. But the moment it was switched on – missiles launched.


That is some serious malfunction that the rocket is launched wwhen the safety is switched off. Worn insulation on the wiring?




The Guardian: https://www.theguard...zapad-war-games

Edited by Panzermann, 20 September 2017 - 0405 AM.

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#27 Chris Werb

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 0423 AM

 

 

Blast radius looks low for what I guess are 80mm rockets. Practice presumably.

 

In the freeze frame showing the initial explosion it looked about what I would have expected from an 80mm or perhaps larger calibre rocket.

 

 

But would you expect to walk away THAT close to an 80mm rocket? 

 

 

Would you expect to be killed by being hit in the side of the head by a .22LR bullet accidentally fired from a boat many hundreds of metres away whilst you were driving a sports car down a coast road in California? Strange things happen. :)


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#28 Stuart Galbraith

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 0429 AM

Here is about the only footage ive found of a KA52 rocket attack. Ill grant you the blast radius looks surprisingly small, but then it is about 5 miles away though a zoom lens.


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#29 bojan

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 0849 AM

In the incident they were lucky cause rockets hit soft earth and partially buried before exploding. Also vehicles got most of frag.


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#30 Stuart Galbraith

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 0853 AM

These dont have proximity fusing?


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#31 GARGEAN

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 0955 AM

These dont have proximity fusing?

They are most probably S-8KOM - HEAT-FRAG. So no prox anyway.
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#32 Stuart Galbraith

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 1009 AM

Thanks for that. :)


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#33 Chris Werb

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Posted 25 September 2017 - 1113 AM

It would be problematic and even perhaps dangerous for rockets launched from helicopters to have proximity fuses, even if the on target effect was considered worthwhile.


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#34 Stuart Galbraith

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Posted 25 September 2017 - 1251 PM

Presumably they have them for the thermobaric ones?


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#35 bd1

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Posted 25 September 2017 - 1503 PM

the imaginary enemy the russian-belorussian coalition is fighting , is ´´veishnoriya´´ , which seems to be based on belorussian western part, which seems to be at odds with lukashenka.

anyway, pretty soon the belorussian internet community picked up the ´´veishnoriya´´ flag and now there seem to be some web groups that claim to be the ´´la resistance´´  :)

 

anyway, currently the ´´veishnoriyan partisans/guerillas´´ claim that

- veishnoriya has replaced successfully all russian and belorussian products with local stuff

- russia has already lost 2 aircraft (tu-22 and one more), 2 trucks with ammo loads, a BTR etc. and now the head of VDV

- veishnoriyan militaryand civilian  casualties - nil

 

all in all, i must say they are doing better than georgians almost decade ago. again - a Tu-22 down, russian general too.... :)


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#36 GARGEAN

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Posted 26 September 2017 - 0134 AM

the imaginary enemy the russian-belorussian coalition is fighting , is ´´veishnoriya´´ , which seems to be based on belorussian western part, which seems to be at odds with lukashenka.
anyway, pretty soon the belorussian internet community picked up the ´´veishnoriya´´ flag and now there seem to be some web groups that claim to be the ´´la resistance´´  :)
 
anyway, currently the ´´veishnoriyan partisans/guerillas´´ claim that
- veishnoriya has replaced successfully all russian and belorussian products with local stuff
- russia has already lost 2 aircraft (tu-22 and one more), 2 trucks with ammo loads, a BTR etc. and now the head of VDV
- veishnoriyan militaryand civilian  casualties - nil
 
all in all, i must say they are doing better than georgians almost decade ago. again - a Tu-22 down, russian general too.... :)

I'm really wondering why there's no such greetings of accidents with loss of human lives on "wrong side of the history"? Why no cheerings about US lieuthenant colonel? Why no happy screams about that italian Typhoon? Oh, maybe that's because of "warmongering" Zapad, which is definitely more evil that truly peaceful Aurora-17, which just accidentally has more personnel involved...
PS: I like this smile on the end most.
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#37 Blunt Eversmoke

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Posted 26 September 2017 - 0321 AM

Might have something to do with whole of Intermarum having been places d'armes posing as countries for too long. Sure leaves traces, or so it seems.


Edited by Blunt Eversmoke, 26 September 2017 - 0321 AM.

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#38 Roman Alymov

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Posted 26 September 2017 - 0433 AM

 

 

I'm really wondering why there's no such greetings of accidents with loss of human lives on "wrong side of the history"? Why no cheerings about US lieuthenant colonel? Why no happy screams about that italian Typhoon? Oh, maybe that's because of "warmongering" Zapad, which is definitely more evil that truly peaceful Aurora-17, which just accidentally has more personnel involved...
PS: I like this smile on the end most.

 

To be frank, cases of giggling among Russian internet users when something is happening with US\NATO warplanes\ships etc are not so rare. People are the same everywhere, sharing the same weaknesses.


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#39 glenn239

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Posted 26 September 2017 - 0717 AM

Yes, that's pretty much why were all armed to the teeth.


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#40 wendist

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Posted 26 September 2017 - 1234 PM

Bad things does happen on this side as well.

 

1.jpeg?$p=042483e&w=1100&$w=dbc5b5e

 

https://www.thelocal...aurora-military

 

 

And yes it´s MSM so everything is a "tank". :glare:


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