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The Middle East War


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#681 Panzermann

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Posted 03 December 2018 - 1957 PM

So they were used as auxiliaries for the Saudis?

 

 

I guess we are in the age of sovereigns renting their armies to other sovereigns again.

 

 

 

Saudi UAE blockade?

 

Ah right. didn't someone of Saud  propose digging a canal to make UAE an island?


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#682 Simon Tan

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Posted 03 December 2018 - 2221 PM

Qatar...the Saudis and UAE are on the same side.
We are a parliamentary democracy as the previous government found out. This was known but not publicly disclosed. Our sovereign is currently on leave. Really...his deputy is standing in
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#683 BansheeOne

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Posted 04 December 2018 - 0432 AM

We are a parliamentary democracy as the previous government found out. This was known but not publicly disclosed.

 

It's always convenient to withhold from the public that they're actually in charge. :D

 

Sorry, back to the Middle East.


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#684 Josh

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Posted 04 December 2018 - 0926 AM

deleted

Edited by Josh, 04 December 2018 - 0928 AM.

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#685 Roman Alymov

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Posted 14 January 2019 - 1434 PM


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#686 Roman Alymov

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Posted 14 January 2019 - 1511 PM

 Iranian Boeing 707 cargo plane (owned by Iran Army) crashed in Tegeran residential area. It was on the way from Kyrgyzstan to deliver cargo to Iran - i wonder what kind of cargo. The only thing comming to my mind are torpedos from "Dastan" plant https://dambiev.live...com/886088.html

 

https://www.rt.com/n...-iranian-crash/


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#687 Adam Peter

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 1316 PM

https://twitter.com/...980408401625088

 

 

The United States is asking Britain, France, Germany and other European allies to take back over 800 ISIS fighters that we captured in Syria and put them on trial. The Caliphate is ready to fall. The alternative is not a good one in that we will be forced to release them........

 

...and the proof of they were ours, not owned by his KSA masters?

 

https://twitter.com/...982979107278850

 

 

....The U.S. does not want to watch as these ISIS fighters permeate Europe, which is where they are expected to go. We do so much, and spend so much - Time for others to step up and do the job that they are so capable of doing. We are pulling back after 100% Caliphate victory!

 

Is bold text a Freudian slip?


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#688 sunday

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 1631 PM

I am not sure if this could be here or in the FFZ, but as there is talking about repatriation of western citizens that fought for ISIS, it could be proper to post here.
 
https://twitter.com/...160163318996993
 

thoughts on Western ISIS fighters from a resident of Mosul who had to live under them

It was hell on Earth and every single one of them made it so. I'm afraid they will be released later under the umbrella of human rights & women rehabilitation programs. After all, we are 2nd class humans. We must apologize for disturbing their stay in here,may be.

It’s amazing to me that captured Western Isis members are framed primarily as people who might or might not harm their home countries. The are colonizers who enslaved, raped and murdered Syrians and Iraqis, who were then killed by the thousands during the campaign to oust them.

As in all fascist movements, in ISIS, women took part in the violence. Foreign ISIS women formed an all-female brigade to torture local women. ISIS woman helped run the enslavement of Yezidi women and owned enslaved women themselves

The US-led anti-ISIS campaign killed many thousands of civilians. In Iraq, an untold number were murdered by militias fighting Isis. These deaths aren’t just unmourned in the West. They are not even mentioned. No one talks about reparations, about rebuilding.

Westerners went to the Syria and Iraq to fulfill their violent fantasies. They raped and murdered locals. Then Western governments bombed Syrian and Iraqi cities into dust because they were worried about terrorist attacks by those westerners.

...The Syrian and Iraqi people who suffered and died under all of this don’t matter. They are not even worth listening to

In terms of Western responsibility- what services are offered to the young Syrian and Iraqi girls who were forced to marry Western ISIS fighters? Or to the Syrian and Iraqi women enslaved by Western fighters? What do the fighters countries owe them?
 
more innocent housewifely activities by female ISIS members

There need to be war crimes prosecutions for these people

Dzn59knW0AAeAoo.jpg

The question of whether Western ISIS members should be taken back by their home countries is in some ways a question of whether a British person who commits serious crimes abroad should be tried in the country where he allegedly committed the crime or be brought back to the UK

I believe that countries need to compensate the victims of crimes commited by their ISIS fighter citizens. In one case I know of, a college educated Belgian man stole the apartment of a Syrian man, then purchased and repeatedly raped an enslaved Iraqi woman.

The Belgian man was killed during the war. But what of his victims?

There are many people who speak fluent English and lived under ISIS occupation who the British media could ask to comment on #ShamimaBegum. I’d rather listen to them than the usual tabloid donkeys

A few people who media can talk to
@MosulEye @AliBaroodi @marwanhishampen


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#689 Roman Alymov

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 1616 PM

https://www.calibreo...-in-anbar-iraq/

The Desert Insurgency: Arms of ISIS in Anbar, Iraq


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#690 Roman Alymov

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 1644 PM

https://www.middleea...WB58iv3BR20mv7c

British army permitted shooting of civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan
Soldiers who served in Basra in 2007 say they were told they could shoot anyone holding a phone or a shovel, or acting in any way suspiciously

Two former soldiers with the battalion, who operated from different bases, say they were told that under the new rules they could shoot anyone seen with a mobile telephone, carrying a shovel, or acting suspiciously, such as being on the roof of a building.

Civilians carrying shovels came to be seen as legitimate targets because of the number of improvised explosive devices that were being dug in beside roads


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#691 Tim the Tank Nut

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Posted 20 February 2019 - 1112 AM

so what?

Wars are kind of like that.  They are brutal and ugly.  That is why we should try to avoid it.

Making war clean and neat? You might as well talk about humanizing hell.

 

I think if we look back at recent history there are a fair number of examples of everyone's military killing people.  As this is TankNet I think we can all be assured that everyone here (except Last Dingo) is aware that troops shoot at threats.  When they don't you get the French casualties in Beirut.

 

As you are less concerned than I am about the possible military threat to Russia from China take a moment to look at how Chinese troops have dealt with Chinese citizens as an example for the level of restraint shown by British troops.  If anything the British are too careful.  One of the reasons Russian is so successful in the Middle East recently is because Russia doesn't fool around.  If the Jihadis manage to kill Russians they know that the response will be overwhelming.  Russia is still willing to carpet bomb and that is definitely a positive when dealing with a culture that views force as a primary social tool.


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#692 Roman Alymov

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Posted 20 February 2019 - 1251 PM

so what?

Wars are kind of like that.  They are brutal and ugly.  That is why we should try to avoid it.

Making war clean and neat? You might as well talk about humanizing hell.

Tim, in general you are right, but i would like to highlight few points:
1. Yes all wars are brutal and bloody, and almost always some innocent people are killed in process. But the wars with no clear objective to reach and no clear enemy to  defeat are especially prone to end up with civilians shot almost randomly . Soviets in Afghanistan were lucky it was age when remote-controlled IEDs, suicide bombers and mobile phones were not invented, so local person walking without rifle was considered safe to ignore (and tales about teenagers with hand grenades were told mostly to keep soldiers alert on their outposts), plus significant number of Soviet conscripts were ethnic Tadjiks and Uzbeks, undistinguishable from locals  - as result, now Soviet veterans are mostly in good relations with former Mujahedin fighters who consider them "good enemy" compared to Western forces who are "bad enemy".  It was lucky coincidence.  Western involvements in Iraq, Afghanistan and, now, Syria are lacking clear objective to reach  - and it is recipe for having the sort of trouble described in article above, and this troubles are eroding concept of "moral high ground" that was one of the pillars of Western domination (other two were economic might and military might). Results of that are now spilling over (see reports of former US and UK servicemen joining Ukraine war in another thread).
2. To your point of Chinese Army  brutality - history of China-Russia conflicts is going centuries back (see https://en.wikipedia...order_conflicts) with both sides quite brutal on each other from time to time (let's leave it without examples)  or, sometimes, contrary, not brutal - see https://en.wikipedia...iki/Albazinians , so there is no doubt  Chinese Army troops could be brutal nowadays as i do not think human kind evolved greatly in this respect. For me as Russian it is not something surprising - as i still remember sound of bullets overhead on streets of Moscow in 1993, and it was just local conflict - so no reason to expect invading foreign troops to be more careful.
3. My Russian background is influencing my perception - and when i am reading stories of locals shot for crossing the road with shovel or just looking suspicious  - my memory is bringing me the tales of Smolensk region village elders who still remember silage pits full of corpses of people shot by Germans for crossing "military road" on their way from village to village to get some potatoes for starving families.


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#693 R011

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Posted 20 February 2019 - 1432 PM

If a story is too good to be true, it probably is and there have been no lack of stories about Western war crimes tgat have turned out to be exaggerations or outright lies. If such a policy existed, then I bet there is a bit more to it than just shoot ragheads with shovels. Probably more like, shoot people with shovels who are obviously planting IEDs or working with others carrying weapons.
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#694 JWB

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Posted 20 February 2019 - 1600 PM

 

so what?

Wars are kind of like that.  They are brutal and ugly.  That is why we should try to avoid it.

Making war clean and neat? You might as well talk about humanizing hell.

........ now Soviet veterans are mostly in good relations with former Mujahedin fighters who consider them "good enemy" compared to Western forces who are "bad enemy".  It was lucky coincidence.  Western involvements in Iraq, Afghanistan and, now, Syria are lacking clear objective to reach.

What do you mean western bad enemy?

Western involvement in those wars do not lack clear objectives. 

War in Iraq was about replacing Saddam with a stable elected government. 

In Syria it is about preventing Erdogan from mass murdering Kurds. Syria and Russia will soon do that in place of western forces.

Afghanistan is about forcing Taliban to respect results of elections. That has not yet succeeded. It might not ever happen. Failure to achieve a policy goal is not the same as having an objective that is unclear. 


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#695 Roman Alymov

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Posted 20 February 2019 - 1729 PM

 

........ now Soviet veterans are mostly in good relations with former Mujahedin fighters who consider them "good enemy" compared to Western forces who are "bad enemy".  It was lucky coincidence.  Western involvements in Iraq, Afghanistan and, now, Syria are lacking clear objective to reach.

What do you mean western bad enemy?

It is not me, it is Afghans themselves - there is a lot of interviews with former Mujahedin fighters and ordinary Afghans who are saying more or less the same - "Russians" (Soviets) were not entering female part of the house (sometimes even when knowing person they are looking for is there), not stepping on holy places with boots, officers consulting with village elders,  soldiers drinking tea with locals, forces constructing factories and housing for locals and so on. Also complains about random drone strikes (tribal chief in one of videos below is saying "They claim this strikes are precise - but what use in it when they strike elders fathering or wedding ceremony?") It is quite logical as USSR in Afghanistan  was following the same Russian Empire\early USSR tactics that transformed Soviet Central Asia into more or less civilized place, plus cultural gap between Soviet conscript from poor village (or even "aul" in Tajikistan mountains) was relatively narrow, they were literally both living somewhere in XIX century ("Russians are simple peasants, like us") , while modern Western servicemen is separated from local Afghan villager by centuries of evolution (not evolution is not always positive thing - it is just changes)
Interviews in Russian

   
Another former Mujahedin opinion in English
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOPLnvEXTiU
Is it possible this interviews do not representing whole population? May be. No way to find out without some kind of syrvey....


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#696 Roman Alymov

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Posted 20 February 2019 - 1744 PM

 

Western involvement in those wars do not lack clear objectives. 

War in Iraq was about replacing Saddam with a stable elected government.

Saddam is long gone....

 

In Syria it is about preventing Erdogan from mass murdering Kurds.


 

You mean NATO invaded Syria to save local Kurds from another NATO member country?

 

 

Afghanistan is about forcing Taliban to respect results of elections.


 

What elections you mean?


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#697 Dark_Falcon

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Posted 20 February 2019 - 1845 PM

 

Saudi crown prince gifted golden submachine gun in Pakistan

 

190220123304-mbs-pakistan-gold-gun-exlar

 

CNN)It's not unusual for dignitaries to receive gifts during visits to foreign countries -- perhaps a Cuban cigar or a bottle of French wine.

But a delegation of Pakistani senators sprang a surprise Monday during a visit by Saudi Arabia's Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman to the country, presenting him with a gold-plated gun.
The Heckler & Koch MP5 is a submachine gun developed by German engineers, and this modified weapon has an elaborate pattern engraved on its gold-plated components.

 

I'm not fond of giving a gun to a murderer, but I take solace in the hope that the sight of an H&K SMG being given to MBS will give various sanctimonious German politicians fits of annoyance. 


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#698 Simon Tan

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Posted 21 February 2019 - 0049 AM

POF is a big supplier to KSA.


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#699 Stuart Galbraith

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Posted 21 February 2019 - 0333 AM

 

 

Saudi crown prince gifted golden submachine gun in Pakistan

 

190220123304-mbs-pakistan-gold-gun-exlar

 

CNN)It's not unusual for dignitaries to receive gifts during visits to foreign countries -- perhaps a Cuban cigar or a bottle of French wine.

But a delegation of Pakistani senators sprang a surprise Monday during a visit by Saudi Arabia's Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman to the country, presenting him with a gold-plated gun.
The Heckler & Koch MP5 is a submachine gun developed by German engineers, and this modified weapon has an elaborate pattern engraved on its gold-plated components.

 

I'm not fond of giving a gun to a murderer, but I take solace in the hope that the sight of an H&K SMG being given to MBS will give various sanctimonious German politicians fits of annoyance. 

 

 

Im disappointed Trumps protection detail dont carry such weapons.


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#700 Leo Niehorster

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Posted 21 February 2019 - 0828 AM

Shhhh! Don't give anyone ideas! :ninja:


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