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Austria To Phase Out Eurofighter


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#1 Dawes

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Posted 07 July 2017 - 1023 AM

It would seem that cost is the main issue here. Since Eurofighter is a high-end, high performance aircraft I would think that higher costs naturally go with the territory. In the case of a replacement, Gripen looks like the logical choice. Second-hand F-16's might also fill the bill but it appears that Austria wants to go with a lease instead of an outright purchase.

 

 

http://www.bundeshee...kel.php?id=4994



#2 Josh

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Posted 07 July 2017 - 1114 AM

How old could their EFs be? Isn't this a really short life cycle? How could 2nd hand F-16s and their maintenance or a Gripen buy really be more expensive than an in service aircraft?

#3 bojan

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Posted 07 July 2017 - 1240 PM

Their EFs were one of 1st series and are basically not compatible with any other EF, they have no A-G ordnance and are maintenance nightmare.



#4 glappkaeft

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Posted 07 July 2017 - 1251 PM

How old could their EFs be? Isn't this a really short life cycle? How could 2nd hand F-16s and their maintenance or a Gripen buy really be more expensive than an in service aircraft?

 

It would save about 2 billion Euros according to Austrian military sources quoted in the Swedish press. The Austrians have contacted SAAB about looking into the terms of buying 15 Gripen C and 3 two seat Gripen D in the 2020-25 time frame and apparently they are also looking at the F-16 (and possibly others). This could be a a complete reversal of the decision (made in 2002) to choose Eurofighter over Gripen, Mirage 2000, F-16 and F-18 after only 10 years of service. If the reports on how little they can afford to fly the Eurofighter and the lack of weapons they have bought are true it looks like that they got the sports car when they needed the family compact. 


Edited by glappkaeft, 07 July 2017 - 1252 PM.


#5 Dawes

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Posted 07 July 2017 - 1359 PM

I take it that Gripen E is a little outside their price range?



#6 glappkaeft

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Posted 07 July 2017 - 1419 PM

I take it that Gripen E is a little outside their price range?

 

Probably not but if they want to replace the Eurofighters as soon as 2020 like some sources state they need to sign a contract soon and deliveries of aircraft to start ASAP. The Gripens are supposed to be new airframes BTW.



#7 Dawes

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Posted 07 July 2017 - 1622 PM

I find it curious that the Austrians didn't know that they were buying a very expensive aircraft in the first place.



#8 Simon Tan

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Posted 07 July 2017 - 2015 PM

The Austrian decision makers of the day were 'influenced'. Austria could fly MiG-21s and it would make no difference.



#9 TOW-2

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Posted 08 July 2017 - 0030 AM

Still, if they go with the Falcon, they can just about buy spares at Discount Auto Parts the damn things are so ubiquitous.  



#10 Panzermann

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Posted 08 July 2017 - 0257 AM

Their EFs were one of 1st series and are basically not compatible with any other EF, they have no A-G ordnance and are maintenance nightmare.

 

This. And also the airframes af Tranche 1 are said to be less durable than later production, because they had not yet perfected manufacture of the fiber materials. And as Tranche 1 Austria is in the same situation as with they used to be with the Draken as the only user. There is a project planned for a unified computersystem across EuFi versions, but that would cost a lot more to install on tranche 1 than later production.

 

And a two jet aeroplane for what is basically an airborne border patrol car in the end (as Austria does not use its planes for anything else) is a bit much with double the engine maintenance costs comapred to a single engine type. Makes you wonder who has been greased. :glare:

 

Or they could finally buy some sidewinders for their Saab 105OE. ;)

But the 105 are sub-sonic and they want a super sonic plane.

 

Heck for their purposes an overhaueled and modernized MiG-21 would be sufficient.

More serious options are Saab JAS 39 (that was turned down last time) or the Gripen NG, lightly used F-16, maybe something from PRC? Austria is neutral after all. hmmm Korean T-50 could do the job. The market offerings for value jet fighters are not so many it seems.



#11 seahawk

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Posted 08 July 2017 - 0514 AM

Great news, finally one country sees the light and removes this nightmare of a plane.



#12 Dawes

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Posted 08 July 2017 - 0737 AM

For border patrol only it seems like an A-29 Super Tucano would be sufficient. And a lot cheaper.



#13 Chris Werb

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Posted 08 July 2017 - 0948 AM

For border patrol only it seems like an A-29 Super Tucano would be sufficient. And a lot cheaper.

 

They wanted to bring fighters back in the 70s (they had previously retired Saab J-29s without proper replacement (Saab 105s) after the US overflew Austria to resupply the Israeli's during the 73 war without their permission. They rapidly purchased Drakens after that. An A-29 is obviously not up to air policing against jet cargo aircraft etc.



#14 Panzermann

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Posted 08 July 2017 - 1310 PM

 

For border patrol only it seems like an A-29 Super Tucano would be sufficient. And a lot cheaper.

 

They wanted to bring fighters back in the 70s (they had previously retired Saab J-29s without proper replacement (Saab 105s) after the US overflew Austria to resupply the Israeli's during the 73 war without their permission. They rapidly purchased Drakens after that. An A-29 is obviously not up to air policing against jet cargo aircraft etc.

 

 

Hence the requirement for supersonic to catch up to interlopers.



#15 Dawes

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Posted 08 July 2017 - 1310 PM

Secondhand F-16's would seem to be an attractive option pricewise.



#16 Panzermann

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Posted 08 July 2017 - 1310 PM

Great news, finally one country sees the light and removes this nightmare of a plane.

 

 

The newer tranches seem to have hit their stride.



#17 seahawk

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Posted 09 July 2017 - 0320 AM

The Tranche 1 fly well too. Every patner nation (except Austria) flies them. The Block 2Bs were the first Eufis to be used in real conflict and upgraded to Block 5 they are more capable than the early Tranche 2. The Austrians ones are special, as they decided to buy them without core components and decided to stay at an early Block2 Standard while everybody else upgraded to Block 5.



#18 lastdingo

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Posted 09 July 2017 - 0412 AM

Let's face it

  • the Western part of Austria is so narrow that air policing could at most be done with several SAM batteries.
  • Vienna is so very close to the border that not even a 5 minute air policing flight would stand a chance to intercept
  • Vienna airport is so very close to the city centre and stadium of Vienna that not even a 5 minute air policing flight would stand a chance to intercept
  • air policing the sovereignty of Austria is near-futile

The Austrians are placing an emphasis on air policing due to their experience with Yugoslavian aircraft during the Slovenian secession, but they seem to forget that no harm would have been done to Austria in that episode anyway.

 

I would reform their military into a nationwide militia with no weapon heavier than a towed 105 mm gun + a military academy that forms officers and educates them about land power well beyond militia things. Austria is far away from any threat and even if one considers the EU as the defensive alliance (that it is according to its treaty), Austria couldn't possibly make a difference in it.

 

Even a mechanised brigade could be created from such a foundation in about six years.



#19 seahawk

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Posted 09 July 2017 - 0520 AM

Most voters in Austria want no fighter jets and I agree that this is the most sensible solution. The armed forces should be cut down to a core functionality with operational missions focussed on humanitarian assistance. That could be a role model for many states in Europe.



#20 urbanoid

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Posted 09 July 2017 - 0531 AM

That sounded like you threw out 'military loving' and only left 'leftist peace monkey'. :P






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