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#1 M48A5K

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0405 AM

South Korean counter-battery radar located in Yeoncheon county spotted a rocket projectile trajectory from North Korean position on 3:52 p.m. The shell is believed to have impacted somewhere near Samgot-ri, where loudspeakers(for propaganda role) are placed. K9's from 28th Division fired several dozen rounds to the NK position about an hour ago. No casualties nor damage on our side, and there's no further firings from the NK yet.


Edited by M48A5K, 20 August 2015 - 0410 AM.

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#2 M48A5K

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0408 AM

http://edition.cnn.c...ions/index.html

 

 

South Korea says it exchanged fire with North at border

 

By K.J. Kwon and Jethro Mullen, CNN

 

Updated 1003 GMT (1703 HKT) August 20, 2015

 

Reports: N. Korea shoots at S. Korean loudpeaker 01:33

 

(CNN)North and South Korea exchanged fire over their heavily fortified border on Thursday, the South Korean Defense Ministry said.

 

South Korea detected a projectile, assumed to be a small rocket, that was fired toward the western province of Gyeonggi, a South Korean Defense Ministry official told CNN.

 

The South Korean military responded by firing a few dozen shells at the area from which the North Korean projectile was fired, the official said.

 

Tensions have spiked on the Korean Peninsula in recent weeks after two South Korean soldiers were seriously wounded by land mines in the demilitarized zone. 

 

South Korea has accused the North of planting the mines, an allegation Pyongyang denies.

Seoul vowed a "harsh" response to the land mines and resumed blaring propaganda messages over the border from huge sets of loudspeakers.

 

The move infuriated North Korea, which restarted its own propaganda broadcasts this week.


Edited by M48A5K, 20 August 2015 - 0410 AM.

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#3 Panzermann

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0637 AM

North Korea wants to send a life sign? Cannot have a headline gap!
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#4 EchoFiveMike

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0714 AM

Meh, ignore them, and cut off all aid.  S/F....Ken M


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#5 Simon Tan

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0755 AM

Waste of perfectly good ammunition.
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#6 JasonJ

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0807 AM

Same thing over and over.

 

South has war game with US

North gets angry and broadcasts death to all for mighty Kim Jong-un

South sends messages across border

North gets angry and broadcasts death to all for mighty Kim Jong-un

North shoots at South.

South fires back at North.

More exchange of heated words.

North vows rainbow policy.

Repeat.


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#7 swerve

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0827 AM

Seoul's unmissable - for the artillery within range. Most N. Korean artillery can't reach it, & most of the rest can only reach the north of the city. And that's before we consider how much of the artillery with the range is actually in the right places - & thus unavailable for fighting on the rest (i.e. most) of the border.


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#8 Simon Tan

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0829 AM

Immediate nuclear riposte against c3 locations and palaces. Fin.
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#9 JasonJ

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0832 AM

If full scale war was to happen, if the South can predict when it would happen, then them installing Iron Dome x10 for Seoul would probably be a good thing to do. Patriot missiles should be able to handle any North Korean ballistic missiles.


Edited by JasonJ, 20 August 2015 - 0832 AM.

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#10 M48A5K

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0859 AM

Detailed reports were released. There were two firings by NK; one with 14.5mm at 3:52 p.m(local time) and several 76.2mm at 4:12 p.m. ROKA returned fire with 20 to 36(numbers vary depending on the source) 155mm shells at 5:04 p.m. No damage on both sides. NK warned ROK government that it would launch larger military actions if the ROK doesn't stop broadcasts and dismantle loudspeakers.

Edited by M48A5K, 20 August 2015 - 0905 AM.

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#11 JasonJ

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0950 AM

Lets bear in mind Kim Jong Un is not quite the same as Kim Jong Il. Anyone whom things executing someone with a flamethrower or an Anti Aircraft gun has some pretty unusual views on leadership. Or maybe he is just a big fan of Dr Evil. :)

 

Not saying this is the time, but I think its inevitable things are going to go wrong sooner or later.

 

I'm not so sure actually because it'll go down when the big powers are in the mood to go in as well. A US led attempt to occupy North Korea will result in Chinese intervention just like in the last one.

 

This is probably another reason why South Korea seems to push back Japan and the US sometimes and tries to cozy up with China sometimes. If the Koreas ever unite by none war means, it needs to be on terms that both China and the US will be fine with. So if South Korea was more friendly with China, then China would find the idea of a united Korea under the South Korean government less repulsive. Russia also has a say because a united Korea under the South Korean flag would also border Russia. Neither Russia nor China wants US troops near their border in the east.

 

If all out war was to ever happen again, US led forces shouldn't go all the way to the border this time and just restrict themselves to going as far as securing Pyongyang on the west side and Wonsan on the east side. In that way, Chinese intervention might be avoidable. Less north Koreans would try running away into China and a buffer would be maintained. Give them some humanitarian supplies to help them cope with the shock of losing Pyongyang and Wonsan after a new cease fire has been signed. It would also make the process of reunification less painful for the current South Korean government. Leave the rest of North Korea for a later time.

 

Well, FWIW at least, just some thoughts...


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#12 bd1

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 0952 AM

Detailed reports were released. There were two firings by NK; one with 14.5mm at 3:52 p.m(local time) and several 76.2mm at 4:12 p.m. ROKA returned fire with 20 to 36(numbers vary depending on the source) 155mm shells at 5:04 p.m. No damage on both sides. NK warned ROK government that it would launch larger military actions if the ROK doesn't stop broadcasts and dismantle loudspeakers.

zis-3?


Edited by bd1, 20 August 2015 - 0953 AM.

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#13 Josh

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 1234 PM

The usual from the DPRK. Pay no mind. I agree with E5's solution, cut off all aid and ignore.

 

I don't particularly see any reason this situation cannot endure indefinitely, unless Kim runs out of North Koreans for some reason. And I can't imagine the ROK wanting the burden of the North; it would devastate the place. I suspect all powers would be fine with the PRC installing some puppet government, in the unlikey case of the regime falling.


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#14 Cinaruco

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 1313 PM

Didn't the Norks actually sunk a frigate? If that doesn't balloons, doubt anything will.


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#15 swerve

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 1530 PM

 

Lets bear in mind Kim Jong Un is not quite the same as Kim Jong Il. Anyone whom things executing someone with a flamethrower or an Anti Aircraft gun has some pretty unusual views on leadership. Or maybe he is just a big fan of Dr Evil. :)

 

Not saying this is the time, but I think its inevitable things are going to go wrong sooner or later.

 

I'm not so sure actually because it'll go down when the big powers are in the mood to go in as well. A US led attempt to occupy North Korea will result in Chinese intervention just like in the last one.

 

This is probably another reason why South Korea seems to push back Japan and the US sometimes and tries to cozy up with China sometimes. If the Koreas ever unite by none war means, it needs to be on terms that both China and the US will be fine with. So if South Korea was more friendly with China, then China would find the idea of a united Korea under the South Korean government less repulsive. Russia also has a say because a united Korea under the South Korean flag would also border Russia. Neither Russia nor China wants US troops near their border in the east.

 

If all out war was to ever happen again, US led forces shouldn't go all the way to the border this time and just restrict themselves to going as far as securing Pyongyang on the west side and Wonsan on the east side. In that way, Chinese intervention might be avoidable. Less north Koreans would try running away into China and a buffer would be maintained. Give them some humanitarian supplies to help them cope with the shock of losing Pyongyang and Wonsan after a new cease fire has been signed. It would also make the process of reunification less painful for the current South Korean government. Leave the rest of North Korea for a later time.

 

Well, FWIW at least, just some thoughts...

 

If all-out war happened again, the way to avoid Chinese intervention is not to have "US-led forces". Given that the S. Korean armed forces are 630000 strong (over 50 times the size of the US forces in Korea - & have about 3 million reserves), with 20 times as many tanks, 70 times as many artillery pieces & MRLs (plus another 50 times as many old guns in reserve), several times as many combat aircraft than US forces in Korea - & so on - why should they be US led?

 

US forces could hang back once the North Koreans at the border have been broken, & loudly announce that they will not advance beyond Pyongyang or wherever, while the S. Koreans engage in frantic diplomatic efforts to keep China & Russia out, e.g promising to leave a wide demilitarised area along the border, arrange the withdrawal of US forces to bases in the south as soon as the fighting's over (while hinting that a nice peaceful northern border would mean there was no longer any need for US forces in Korea at all), etc.


Edited by swerve, 20 August 2015 - 1531 PM.

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#16 tankerwanabe

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 1557 PM

Last week, N.Korea executed the 2nd most powerful person.  

 

Frankly I'm surprised that the S.Koreans don't plant more disinformation to incite N.Korea to start a full purging of the N.Korean Officer corps. 

 

Doesn't seem like it would take much. 


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#17 Nobu

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 1559 PM

I don't like the possibility of a Chinese naval base on the Sea of Japan. That prospect alone could tempt the Chinese to intervene the same way the Soviets did on Sept 17 1939.

 

@Simon: Agree that the riposte would be instant and fatal to NK. The aftermath would be tragically interesting, however.

 

Where is a Jung-geun An when you need one? Surely Jong-un has done more to set the cause of the Korean people and culture back than Ito Hirobumi (Univ College London, 1863) ever did.


Edited by Nobu, 20 August 2015 - 1611 PM.

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#18 bojan

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 1638 PM

That is just a firework for a Laibach concert there (no, I am not fucking kidding - from rabid anti-communists to playing in North Korea in 25 years). :)


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#19 Calvinb1nav

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 1957 PM

I really don't understand why we aren't actively trying to bring down the nK regime. Yes, it would be disastrous but the problem only grows worse with age. It will collapse sooner or later and it'd be easier to track down a handful of nukes rather than 100s 20 years from. More nukes, more nuke scientists, more hackers on the open market, more deforestation, more pollution (somehow I doubt there are any rules about proper disposal of hazardous waste in nK, for example), another generation stunted by malnutrition/under-nutrition, more Chinese influence, wider culture gap with South Korea, etc.

If it were up to me (I ran an information operations team in Korea a few years ago but, alas, as a mere Lt Col, nobody important listened to me) I'd place a network of cell phone towers along the DMZ and then over cell phones/sat phones by balloon. When the nK person used the phone it would connect to a call center who would put them in contact with any relatives they had in South Korea. No propaganda necessary...
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#20 JasonJ

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Posted 20 August 2015 - 2314 PM

Lets bear in mind Kim Jong Un is not quite the same as Kim Jong Il. Anyone whom things executing someone with a flamethrower or an Anti Aircraft gun has some pretty unusual views on leadership. Or maybe he is just a big fan of Dr Evil. :)
 
Not saying this is the time, but I think its inevitable things are going to go wrong sooner or later.

 
I'm not so sure actually because it'll go down when the big powers are in the mood to go in as well. A US led attempt to occupy North Korea will result in Chinese intervention just like in the last one.
 
This is probably another reason why South Korea seems to push back Japan and the US sometimes and tries to cozy up with China sometimes. If the Koreas ever unite by none war means, it needs to be on terms that both China and the US will be fine with. So if South Korea was more friendly with China, then China would find the idea of a united Korea under the South Korean government less repulsive. Russia also has a say because a united Korea under the South Korean flag would also border Russia. Neither Russia nor China wants US troops near their border in the east.
 
If all out war was to ever happen again, US led forces shouldn't go all the way to the border this time and just restrict themselves to going as far as securing Pyongyang on the west side and Wonsan on the east side. In that way, Chinese intervention might be avoidable. Less north Koreans would try running away into China and a buffer would be maintained. Give them some humanitarian supplies to help them cope with the shock of losing Pyongyang and Wonsan after a new cease fire has been signed. It would also make the process of reunification less painful for the current South Korean government. Leave the rest of North Korea for a later time.
 
Well, FWIW at least, just some thoughts...
If all-out war happened again, the way to avoid Chinese intervention is not to have "US-led forces". Given that the S. Korean armed forces are 630000 strong (over 50 times the size of the US forces in Korea - & have about 3 million reserves), with 20 times as many tanks, 70 times as many artillery pieces & MRLs (plus another 50 times as many old guns in reserve), several times as many combat aircraft than US forces in Korea - & so on - why should they be US led?
 
US forces could hang back once the North Koreans at the border have been broken, & loudly announce that they will not advance beyond Pyongyang or wherever, while the S. Koreans engage in frantic diplomatic efforts to keep China & Russia out, e.g promising to leave a wide demilitarised area along the border, arrange the withdrawal of US forces to bases in the south as soon as the fighting's over (while hinting that a nice peaceful northern border would mean there was no longer any need for US forces in Korea at all), etc.

Fair point. Although taking Pyongyang will need a lot so I suspect the US will have to help in that. But anything like climbing into Nork tunnels will have to be the work of the South Koreans.

I don't like the possibility of a Chinese naval base on the Sea of Japan. That prospect alone could tempt the Chinese to intervene the same way the Soviets did on Sept 17 1939.
 
@Simon: Agree that the riposte would be instant and fatal to NK. The aftermath would be tragically interesting, however.
 
Where is a Jung-geun An when you need one? Surely Jong-un has done more to set the cause of the Korean people and culture back than Ito Hirobumi (Univ College London, 1863) ever did.


Yeah, Ironically, North Korea and Russia instead of China bordering the Sea of Japan, especially in the last 5 years is better.
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