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Leopard Tank Question


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#41 KV7

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Posted 15 July 2019 - 1350 PM

What is the rationale for using quite thick plates with a single thin bulging plate vs. NERA with a thicker interlayer and two flyer plates ?


Edited by KV7, 15 July 2019 - 1353 PM.

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#42 Rick

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Posted 15 July 2019 - 1727 PM

VbAtUVl10Wk.jpg

 

1976  Leopard 2AV armour(all from declassified reports) 

 

 

What is the bulging plate (in olive ?) made from ?

mild steel i think, but no data in report

 

 

 

 

With the context of marking high hardness and TL steels and where the plates marked w are, I could imagine the "w" stands for weich, that is soft or mild (steel).

 

maybe, thank you

Ex-sailor question, but why that set up of spaced, "thin" plates?


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#43 Paul Lakowski

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Posted 15 July 2019 - 2104 PM

I cant read the Russian, but the rational I got was mild steel plates [1/4 of the price of HHS] was just as effective if not even more effective than hard armor plates . These mild steel plates put increasing lateral strain simultaneously on the long rod penetrator at different places along the rod.

Best guess, this reduces/breaks up the penetrator.
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#44 Interlinked

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Posted 15 July 2019 - 2106 PM

Ex-sailor question, but why that set up of spaced, "thin" plates?


Hard to say. As a whole, the armour design seems to be rather inefficient.

Edited by Interlinked, 15 July 2019 - 2108 PM.

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#45 Wiedzmin

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Posted 15 July 2019 - 2254 PM

What is the rationale for using quite thick plates with a single thin bulging plate vs. NERA with a thicker interlayer and two flyer plates ?

Without thick plates you doesn't have KE protection, so, you must make spaced array of steel before and after(or between)light NERA package(early chobham armour variants gain KE protection only from spaced armour part, NERA was only against CE) , or use it like on leo2av, t72b, where you have plates thick enough to work against KE and bulging plates helps against CE

+ it's better to have thick back plate to stop damaged rod (like on cr1/2, m1, t-series)

Edited by Wiedzmin, 15 July 2019 - 2301 PM.

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#46 Ssnake

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 0239 AM

The AV was never meant to be representative of the ACTUAL armor configuration. The intent was that the armor cavities would be filled with whatever the US would choose to place there, but that for the purpose of evaluation/trials "something" had to be put in there to approximate the weight. In the US Chrysler (to save the XM-1) and the unions then started a smear campaign that the armor protection was inadequate (well, duh!) and that the US would "buy" a foreign tank when the explicit intent was a license production completely under US control. Irrespective of the question whether the Leopard ever had a chance to be adopted by the US (I don't think so), poring over the details of the AV's armor package is a complete waste of time.


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#47 Ssnake

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 0244 AM

 

thickness

 

260mm from front face of frontal 15mm plate to rear face of rear 20mm plate(225m "pocket" for special armour consisting of 12mm HHA and 4mm bulging plate)

 

"hh" - hohe Härte 

TL - TL spec steel 

"w" i don't know, maybe some german speaking members could help 

Lochblech - perforated sheet

 

With the context of marking high hardness and TL steels and where the plates marked w are, I could imagine the "w" stands for weich, that is soft or mild (steel).

 

"weich" appears rather unspecific; it could equally well stand for "Walzstahl" (rolled armor plate) which at least would signify some production standard.


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#48 Wiedzmin

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 0300 AM

The AV was never meant to be representative of the ACTUAL armor configuration. The intent was that the armor cavities would be filled with whatever the US would choose to place there, but that for the purpose of evaluation/trials "something" had to be put in there to approximate the weight. In the US Chrysler (to save the XM-1) and the unions then started a smear campaign that the armor protection was inadequate (well, duh!) and that the US would "buy" a foreign tank when the explicit intent was a license production completely under US control. Irrespective of the question whether the Leopard ever had a chance to be adopted by the US (I don't think so), poring over the details of the AV's armor package is a complete waste of time.

i will add firing trials for this version later, it's not very detailed, but uses US spec threats for tests 

 

GwZM7Ze1GPE.jpg

GwDoRntZkQ8.jpg

just some random photo of Leopard 2AV

 

 

"weich" appears rather unspecific; it could equally well stand for "Walzstahl" (rolled armor plate) which at least would signify some production standard.

 

thank you


Edited by Wiedzmin, 16 July 2019 - 0303 AM.

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#49 Ssnake

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 0459 AM

BOTH are, however, speculation. "w" is nothing but a single letter.


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