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Future Uk Infantry Rifle


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#121 bojan

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 2109 PM

Problem is that bayonets are generally pretty poor as both utility and fighting knifes. There might be few exceptions, but those either evolved from tools (AKM bayonet/saw/wire cutter which sucks as a knife) or from propper fighting knives (some of the dagger/dirk style bayonets that suck as a utility tool).


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#122 Simon Tan

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 2306 PM

It is a British thing to not carry enough ammunition I suppose and lug around a magazines worth if weight.
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#123 lastdingo

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 0215 AM

A knife is typically not so good for stabbing, and being a knife (= one edge) also fairly easy to push away in the bayonet role during crowd control.

A proper bayonet that's more than a 18th century bayonet (= triangular spike), but not terribly heavy like 20th century bayonets should thus be close to a Fairbairn-Sykes dagger (the Fairbairn-Sykes is often called "knife"; but it's a dagger). That's also the most effective pattern for a knife-ish melee blade nowadays.

 

None of this changes that a soldier should be able to make do with a  15 g folding knife for meals (tested it myself - it's easily enough, includiong for steaks) and a skeletonised multi tool (~154CM blade) as tool.


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#124 bojan

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 0240 AM

...

A proper bayonet that's more than a 18th century bayonet (= triangular spike), but not terribly heavy like 20th century bayonets should thus be close to a Fairbairn-Sykes dagger (the Fairbairn-Sykes is often called "knife"; but it's a dagger). That's also the most effective pattern for a knife-ish melee blade nowadays....

 

Hence why I wrote that those bayonets actually useful for CC fighting were actually descendants of the fighting knives. They are however pretty poor as a utility knives. "Universal solutions universally suck"

M1899.jpg

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M1956.jpg

etc


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#125 Briganza

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 0306 AM

Don't forget the pig sticker.


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#126 Stuart Galbraith

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 0306 AM

One of the best regarded fighting knives of WW2 would probably have been piss poor as a bayonet, and probably not much use as a utility knife.

https://en.wikipedia..._fighting_knife

 

I might add about crowd control, I think this is over emphasized. Ive looked through a British army COIN manual dating from the early 70's (Its so old, its got imagery of Aden in it), and there is not one line I can find that even references a bayonet. Maybe its in part one, but as this part actually talks about crowd control, I actually doubt it. If you think about it, if you fix bayonets, you are send a signal you are about to go pigsticking. Which if you are trying to calm a crowd down (particularly an Arab or Irish one) its probably not the message you really ought to be sending.


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#127 bojan

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 0312 AM

One of the best regarded fighting knives of WW2 would probably have been piss poor as a bayonet, and probably not much use as a utility knife.

https://en.wikipedia..._fighting_knife

...

As you could have seen it is the same idea as a 2nd one, khanjali type. Other two share blade type, but compromised with a handle.


Edited by bojan, 12 July 2018 - 0313 AM.

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#128 bojan

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 0314 AM

Don't forget the pig sticker.

Those are generally poor as bayonet, knife and a tool. But they were cheaper and simpler to make than blade types, hence a popularity.


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#129 lastdingo

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 0433 AM

One of the best regarded fighting knives of WW2 would probably have been piss poor as a bayonet, and probably not much use as a utility knife.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairbairn–Sykes_fighting_knife
...

As you could have seen it is the same idea as a 2nd one, khanjali type. Other two share blade type, but compromised with a handle.


Sorry, I don't quite get what you wrote there.
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#130 Chris Werb

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 1115 AM

Stick a blade on the end of the can and you're done 😁
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#131 JWB

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 1150 AM

On a related note, better than a knife?

 


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