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Knm Helge Ingstad Collision


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#141 BansheeOne

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Posted 16 November 2018 - 1613 PM

This was the explanation I found, in particular the comment by Kato that this is a common manoeuvre for the German navy. So a routine manoeuvre gone wrong. I've been or near enough collisions and near misses to know that it happens.

 

Well, apparently it was done frequently, but not quite as a routine rather than an "everybody winks and smiles as long as nothing goes wrong" manoeuvre. In this case, the Marine not only relieved the CO, but also went after the guys who took the video for possible dereliction of duty and damaging the reputation of the Bundeswehr (though they allowed it was also very helpful for the accident investigation).

 

The Schnellboot drivers used to be called "Baltic rockers" for a reason ...


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#142 Panzermann

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Posted 16 November 2018 - 1623 PM

 

This was the explanation I found, in particular the comment by Kato that this is a common manoeuvre for the German navy. So a routine manoeuvre gone wrong. I've been or near enough collisions and near misses to know that it happens.

 

Well, apparently it was done frequently, but not quite as a routine rather than an "everybody winks and smiles as long as nothing goes wrong" manoeuvre. In this case, the Marine not only relieved the CO, but also went after the guys who took the video for possible dereliction of duty and damaging the reputation of the Bundeswehr (though they allowed it was also very helpful for the accident investigation).

 

The Schnellboot drivers used to be called "Baltic rockers" for a reason ...

 

 

Schnellboot crews were kind of the hussars of the navy. Well the only thing they have over other vessels is their speed and agility.


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#143 lastdingo

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Posted 16 November 2018 - 1731 PM

...and small draft. They were able to 'hide' by mooring really close to the coast, or waiting in tiny fishing harbours.


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#144 rmgill

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Posted 16 November 2018 - 1732 PM

 

 

This was the explanation I found, in particular the comment by Kato that this is a common manoeuvre for the German navy. So a routine manoeuvre gone wrong. I've been or near enough collisions and near misses to know that it happens.

 
Well, apparently it was done frequently, but not quite as a routine rather than an "everybody winks and smiles as long as nothing goes wrong" manoeuvre. In this case, the Marine not only relieved the CO, but also went after the guys who took the video for possible dereliction of duty and damaging the reputation of the Bundeswehr (though they allowed it was also very helpful for the accident investigation).
 
The Schnellboot drivers used to be called "Baltic rockers" for a reason ...

 

 
Schnellboot crews were kind of the hussars of the navy. Well their only weapons are their speed and agility and surprise.

 


FIFY

monty-python-spanish-inquisition.jpg​


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#145 DB

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Posted Yesterday, 06:34 AM

An ex merchant navy fellow that I used to work with also had a poor opinion of RN basic seamanship. That was nearly 20 years ago. I doubt it's improved. He put it down to insufficient training and lack of practice. MN crews are always at sea, and tend to do nothing else.
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#146 TonyE

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Posted Today, 08:56 AM

Big crane is arrive. Meanwhile the navy is reporting that the wreck is in motion and unstable.

b0cac13052b648856b6fb7b12521d9de.jpg


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#147 shep854

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Posted Today, 11:43 AM

What kind of slope is she sitting on and how deep does it get?


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#148 civilian

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Posted Today, 11:57 AM

Oops. Please delete.


Edited by civilian, Today, 11:58 AM.

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#149 TonyE

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Posted Today, 12:19 PM

What kind of slope is she sitting on and how deep does it get?

 

It is somewhat steep, going from 0 to 40m depth out to a distance of 200 meters from the shore, the current and tide is also strong in the area which keeps the wreck moving, if it breaks loose it might end up sliding down to 40m depth where there is a minor bowl shaped plain which is several hundred meters wide in all direction and surrounded by shallower waters on all sides.


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#150 shep854

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Posted Today, 12:43 PM

Would it be beyond economical salvage?


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#151 TonyE

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Posted Today, 01:06 PM

The navy doesn`t (or dare) say anything about it, or as little as possible and the media is totally clueless as always, a few opinion pieces have pointed out the problems with everything high-tech being submerged in seawater. Imho it is a total wreck and a write-off, but no one dare to say it out loud. Everything would have to replaced and the hull stripped down to bare basics before it could be rebuilt. One such ship alone cost more than the current annual budget of the navy and that was back in 2009, today it would cost way more. Propably it would be more economical to build a new ship (or two ships of a modified design, since one-ship classes are not very economical in a small navy), but as the navy seem to treating their ships like expendable cutlery it might be better if parliament tell them to make do with what they have.


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#152 Chris Werb

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Posted Today, 02:58 PM

The navy doesn`t (or dare) say anything about it, or as little as possible and the media is totally clueless as always, a few opinion pieces have pointed out the problems with everything high-tech being submerged in seawater. Imho it is a total wreck and a write-off, but no one dare to say it out loud. Everything would have to replaced and the hull stripped down to bare basics before it could be rebuilt. One such ship alone cost more than the current annual budget of the navy and that was back in 2009, today it would cost way more. Propably it would be more economical to build a new ship (or two ships of a modified design, since one-ship classes are not very economical in a small navy), but as the navy seem to treating their ships like expendable cutlery it might be better if parliament tell them to make do with what they have.

 

Or it might make more sense to take the replacement budget and savings from ceasing to operate this ship and invest them in some shore-based NSM, reactivating your M270s (or better still replacing them with HIMARS) and more mobile SAMs and MANPADS.


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#153 Laser Shark

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Posted Today, 03:00 PM

IMO we should not spend hundreds of millions of dollars on repairing HING or replace her with a new frigate when we barely have enough crews for the remaining ones. As things stand today, there are four frigate crews in the Norwegian Navy, and we’re currently in the process of establishing a fifth one. Now while this may sound well and good to the average Joe or Ola (“five crews for five frigates”), it's a lot less impressive if you consider that one ought to assign not just one, but two crews to a frigate to keep her active during the whole year. That is the case in other navies, and it used to be the case in the Royal Norwegian Navy as well, but because we've neglected the military since the end of the Cold War, a docked Nansen has not exactly been an uncommon sight…


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#154 Laser Shark

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Posted Today, 03:06 PM

Or it might make more sense to take the replacement budget and savings from ceasing to operate this ship and invest them in some shore-based NSM, reactivating your M270s (or better still replacing them with HIMARS) and more mobile SAMs and MANPADS.

 

 

Alternatively, we could just buy another Type 212CD or scrap the plans to scrap the Skjold class after the F-35/JSM combo is declared operational.


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#155 Yama

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Posted Today, 03:07 PM

Doesn't Royal Navy have pretty much same situation with Darings? Not enough crews for all?
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